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Post by Almenning on Apr 13, 2018 17:59:12 GMT -5
I guess Abbath was using the themes/lyrics to define the genre maybe? Yeah I think that's what they were going for. I never read the lyrics but I'm aware of the Blashyrkh concept. Is there any consistent narrative being developed through the albums or is it just a loose point of reference? |
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Post by nahadoth on Apr 13, 2018 22:57:46 GMT -5
Well, I think Stormcrow is arguing that the later albums became distinct from even 2nd wave black metal, and that I would agree with - it's still great, immersive music with a powerful fantasy vibe, but yeah the sound is definitely thrashier on everything from ATHOW onward. And we hear Hints of that change on Blizzard Beasts.
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Post by stormcrow on Apr 14, 2018 12:28:07 GMT -5
I'm speaking about riffing in particular. In the 2nd wave of BM there was almost no palm-muted guitar, which is a clear heavy metal trademark, most of the riffing was "open" or tremolo-picked in mandolin/balalaika style. I felt more punk than metal attitude in trve BM.
Listen at the structures too: BM has almost no shape in terms of verse/middle/chorus, no heroic refrain in major key, no guitar solo or fast licks etc.
Said this, I'm loving SOND or ATHOW just because reminds me of the genre I'm mostly bound to (Judas, Iron and Manowar HM!) since my childhood.
Blizzard beasts is of course a transition record, but probably my favourite with Pure Holocaust.
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kktz
Cleric
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Post by kktz on Apr 14, 2018 12:50:54 GMT -5
I'm speaking about riffing in particular. In the 2nd wave of BM there was almost no palm-muted guitar, which is a clear heavy metal trademark, most of the riffing was "open" or tremolo-picked in mandolin/balalaika style. I felt more punk than metal attitude in trve BM. Listen at the structures too: BM has almost no shape in terms of verse/middle/chorus, no heroic refrain in major key, no guitar solo or fast licks etc. Said this, I'm loving SOND or ATHOW just because reminds me of the genre I'm mostly bound to (Judas, Iron and Manowar HM!) since my childhood. Blizzard beasts is of course a transition record, but probably my favourite with Pure Holocaust. Agree on the difference between other types of metal which are all about palm muting and pure BM with it's tremolo-picking. But you are wrong about punk. As other types of metal, punk is power chord and verse / chorus based. While BM is not always power chord, more chaotic and dark chords even when very primitive, that's what creates the pure BM style together with tremolo. |
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Post by stormcrow on Apr 14, 2018 15:05:16 GMT -5
You are right about type of intervals and structures, in fact I was speaking about a "punk attitude" meaning raw strummed strings instead of pulm-muted, slight offsets (that somehow bring further expression!) instead of perfect timing etc.
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Post by Almenning on Apr 14, 2018 17:22:04 GMT -5
You stired an interesting debate stormcrow. I definitely agree with what you're saying, Immortal is rooted on a lot of classic HM/TM. Even their propensity to become memme targets derives from the theatrics they adopted from acts like KISS, that's why they don't take themselves seriously, its just rock n' roll. Just great musicians who want to put on a great show and have fun playing good tunes. That immediately sets them apart from all the kvlt bull. Its funny how none of the early bands are kvlt anymore but everyone else still behaves like they're trying to impress Euronymous, but I digress. It may also be interesting to note that all these early acts have only one or two albums which are considered pure BM and after that they just progress into something their own, and yet still are considered BM. I guess no matter the structure,strumming techniques,etc you can have almost unlimited diversity and still maintain a BM sound. |
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kktz
Cleric
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Post by kktz on Apr 15, 2018 3:33:34 GMT -5
You are right about type of intervals and structures, in fact I was speaking about a "punk attitude" meaning raw strummed strings instead of pulm-muted, slight offsets (that somehow bring further expression!) instead of perfect timing etc. Yes. I also like how they were going for more raw production too, as opposed to already sterile death metal studios. But when most of the early bands changed their music they changed the production too, and for me biggest part of Norwegian Black Metal magic is gone. You don't like Battles in the North? It is a pure BM album, and my first by them, lots of tremolo, some people don't like raw drums but I like it much more than sterile sounding triggered drums of today. |
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Post by stormcrow on Apr 15, 2018 4:59:31 GMT -5
You are right about type of intervals and structures, in fact I was speaking about a "punk attitude" meaning raw strummed strings instead of pulm-muted, slight offsets (that somehow bring further expression!) instead of perfect timing etc. Yes. I also like how they were going for more raw production too, as opposed to already sterile death metal studios. But when most of the early bands changed their music they changed the production too, and for me biggest part of Norwegian Black Metal magic is gone. You don't like Battles in the North? It is a pure BM album, and my first by them, lots of tremolo, some people don't like raw drums but I like it much more than sterile sounding triggered drums of today. Oh yeah I like Battles! Surely their rawest album ever! |
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Post by druadDS on Apr 15, 2018 15:26:29 GMT -5
Musicaly, I think they're solid...but I've always had a problem with Abbath's clowny attitude...not that I'm an elitist, but it just kills the music's mood for me so I've never considered to spend big time on them.
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Post by stormcrow on Apr 16, 2018 1:05:54 GMT -5
Musicaly, I think they're solid...but I've always had a problem with Abbath's clowny attitude...not that I'm an elitist, but it just kills the music's mood for me so I've never considered to spend big time on them. ahahahah I know what you mean! Anyway, that could be a fine marketing strategy.... and I think it worked! Early Immortal were less clowny.... though they always had some Manowar-style bombastic attitude.... |
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Post by knolf on Oct 23, 2020 22:10:29 GMT -5
Immortal seems to me a colorful feeling of black metal. At the Heart of Winter is a fave of mine with it's imagery of the one thing that rules over all. The cold force of nature. The vocals are some of my favorites to practice to get that raw (yet comfortable and natural) grit sound. I'd love to play this on guitar, but years of bad technique has put my dreams of becoming the tremolo-iest guitarist out there. Though, I've settled for programing music instead lol. Here's a little bit of Withstand the Fall of time on a Gameboy: youtu.be/BPrPDOvDa4w |
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haiduk
Peasant
exomancer
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Post by haiduk on May 3, 2021 19:37:38 GMT -5
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i'm a newbie here, thanks for the approval!